Garbage M2 distros


#21

Sorry, that wasn’t my intention. I just wanted to point out that focusing on GPU drivers (especially dead projects like the one you referred to) is useless when it’s about HW accelerated video decoding.

You won’t see this on Banana Pi M2 since the A31s is already discontinued and no one is working on this. But I would suspect @noralee will tell you quite the opposite. According to herself she is responsible for Banana Pi at Foxconn (and she’s also the producer of the faked video claiming HW accelerated video decoding being possible on the M2). At least she should know what she’s talking about.


(noralee) #22

Dear Rab,

Did you mean that I upload M2 video by https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xsXg_ZoHBVQ that fools people? After checking image version should be ubuntu V14.04 but 15.04, tks for your correction! We will release ubuntu 14.04 this week. So sorry I listed wrong version on YouTube.

Nora


#23

No, you opened a small video file definitely not being 1080p (“The video is 26.2 MB in size and plays 5 minutes long” according to BPI-M3 android 5.1.1 test hardware function ) and claim you got HW accelerated video encoding on the M2. But this low resolution video was decoded on the CPU cores.

You still DID NOT deliver drivers/software to be able to use HW accelerated video decoding on the M2. And I doubt this will ever happen.


BPI-M3 video decode for linux
(Joe C. Hecht) #24

I would be very interested in seeing any release Distro used in any of the promo’s for the M3 that have been posted, that can do 1080p (with drivers and with sound).

So far, Many promo videos have been posted showing a lot of claims that cannot be proven, with some being proven as begin questionably less than than honest.

The only thing that has been proven is that the board was released for sale, no usable official Linux distro is available for purchasers that performs in any way shown my the official postings, and the board is a total paperweight to those who have purchased.

This sort of activity is very damaging to your reputation. I would recommend that you DO NOT POST ANYTHING that is not working, and ready to download.

It’s your company, your name, and the reports are getting ready to hit the airwaves. You are now the position of having to perform "damage control’. For this part of he world, the best thing you can say is “We blew it”, sorry, and here are the good distros, and they work well. Continuing to post videos demonstrating anything less than good, accurate, and with provable accelerated 1080p video and sound will only help to send the company into bankruptcy, as your reputation is suffering badly, and the reports are spreading fast.

An apology is what you should be posting, and any work on promo videos should be deferred, and that time should be used to get the M2 and M3 working for those you have sold board too already.


(bpi team) #25

all development is a hard work, if you have a good idea ,welcome to join us and help us to do some development. we can not finished anything one day . we only try our best .


(noralee) #26

Dear Rab,

I saw that you complains M2 but M3, we’ll improve M2 video first then M3 will be next one to improve it.

From Rab: You won’t see this on Banana Pi M2 since the A31s is already discontinued and no one is working on this. But I would suspect @noralee will tell you quite the opposite. According to herself she is responsible for Banana Pi at Foxconn (and she’s also the producer of the faked video claiming HW accelerated video decoding being possible on the M2). At least she should know what she’s talking about.

Nora


#27

You tell us now at the end of 2015 that you will improve the situation with the M2 first and then start working on the M3?

The very same person that published a video on 12.05.2015 claiming “Banana Pi BPI-M2 A31S runs Ubuntu 14.04 which supports video 1080p HW decode” (this is the video title you assigned) tells us 7 months later that you start now to implement the features you promised even before the M2 sales started?

I still don’t get it. This is just a scam. A colleague of mine bought the M2 for exactly this reason (HTPC). And what is he doing now with it? Using it at least as an overheating headless server running Armbian (since NONE of your OS images worked reliably. NOT A SINGLE ONE).

As Joe already pointed out the only possible conclusion is "Banana Pi - DO NOT BUY"


(Joe C. Hecht) #28

IDEA: Do not promote capabilities for boards you are selling that you do not have.

IDEA: Do not sell boards that you cannot deliver the capabilities that you you promote.

IDEA: Realize that in many locals, these are criminal offenses considered to be fraud.

IDEA: Buy back the boards you have sold that do not have the capabilities you promote.

IDEA: Try your best not to release until you have something of minimal acceptable quality.

IDEA: Don’t sell me a board then try to get me to help you make it right after the fact (because development is hard).

IDEA: Try to send me boards in advance of sale to distro developers, and cooperate with those distro developers to produce quality products that are ready for release when you start selling them.

IDEA: Take a basic class in business, so you know what is needed so that you do not fail.

IDEA: Hire someone that reads, writes, and speaks good english, knows how customer relations work, and and put them in charge of public relations and make them your front man.

IDEA: It’s not what YOU can show and promote, it’s what you users can make and promote. Raspberry Pi is successful because the users of the boards build things and promote for them. The Raspberry Pi is loved and embraced by many (even though they are not the best). Right now, your users are publically kicking you, and the company is suffering from a very bad reputation of non-delivery. When you post a promo video, people look to see what kind of lie you are trying to tell. What does that say? Your doing things all wrong, and that spells failure.

Want Ideas for success? There ya go. Make something good, then promote it, and get the right person to promote it for you.

Nvidia has ONE good distro. You better believe the drivers DO work.

You have something like a dozen disros, and none of them work right.

Want to fail? Keep doing what you are doing.

I so want you to succeed, but I publically look like a fool for ever backing your project. The M2 and M3 that I bought are worthless paperweights. I pulled them out today, and threw them in a box. I cannot even sell them and feel good about it. Apparently you can. I have honor. What does that say about yours?

I see the posts of what Babana M2 and M3 can do, and all I can say is I get mad. Really mad.

I tried every one of the posted distros. They are all garbage. You waited my time, and lots of it. And that’s worth a lot more than whatever I spent on the boards.

Why not quite spending time showing promos all sorts of things that will not work for users.

Make one thing that will work well, and show that off.

Get Nora to go back to answering the phone, and find someone good to promote your stuff. Make a better website,get a magazine, take a look at ODROID (hardkernel.com). Like you, they struggle. Unlike you, they have a well cut jib, a nice site, a magazine, an editor that speaks more than 3 words of broken english, good distribution channels, and they don’t make excuses, they make apologies (were needed), they make promises, then they fulfill the promises they made.

I don’t know if this is a volunteer operation or not. it looks like one, because it looks like crap. If it is, do yourself a favor, and find someone else that stands better bet for success. If this is not a volunteer operation, do yourself (and all of us) a favor, and march in to the boss’s office and tell them to either give you the resources to make this operation work right, or your gonna walk out. Don’t forget, your names on the line too, and you don;t want your name associated with a company that operates like this. Or do you?

Take a look a ODROID. They kick your ass, Quit the excuses and rise to the occasion.

Joe


(noralee) #29

Dear Rab,

As we don’t have enough resource, we only can improve M2 video first, if you would like to help to improve M3 that will be welcome!

Below demo for M2 video HW decode and GPU improvement:

BPI M2 A31S runs ubuntu 14.04.3 at 1080p by video HW decode

BPI M2 GPU demo:

P.S.: Above video HW decode and GPU images will be released this week.

Nora


(lionwang) #30

sorry for this , i am lionwang. i just want to do a good project ,thank you for you good suggest.

you can contact me with :lionwang@banana-pi.com ,


(Joe C. Hecht) #31

“As we don’t have enough resource”

Well, there ya go folks. This might have done better as a kickstarter project.

As it stands now, the best thing is to do is bury the Banana Pi project and move on. No good leadership and no real backing. Sad, but there are better boards on the horizon to invest our resources and time on.


#32

That is all just sad. :frowning:


#33

But why don’t you do it then? It seems you only focus on quantity and not quality. Why do you release so many OS images if none of them works as customers would expect? What’s the reason behind?

Given you advertised the M2 being able to use HW acceleration to play video over half a year ago I don’t understand this sentence. Are you able to help me understand how it’s possible to start now with HW acceleration when you demonstrated months ago that it already works?


(Joe C. Hecht) #34

And thus why we are adding a “-1” to our rating system, indicating “Call The Police” (or a good attorney specializing in class action lawsuits).

There are a lot of laws regarding “knowingly selling and advertising defective products”. While I doubt those laws stretch to China, they can cover 3rd party resellers, making it (in theory) possible to block products from being marketed or sold in a region :stuck_out_tongue:

Joe


#35

I bought my M2 here: https://www.conrad.de/de/banana-pi-2-1-gb-ohne-betriebssystem-1317452.html

There they describe the M2 as being able to provide composite video output (RCA) like M1. I talked to them already and informed them that this is not true, since the M2 can only output through HDMI or LVDS: http://linux-sunxi.org/Banana_Pi_M2 (well, and I also had to learn that this volunteer linux-sunxi project seems to be the only realible information source for the various Bananas)

They told me they got this wrong information from the manufacturer as well as the distributor: http://bananapiwarehouse.com/banana-pi-m2/

So it’s an easy one to return the product :smile: (and since a lot of people are returning M2/M3 these days they’re already thinking about stopping to sell the newer models).

The M3 is sold in Germany as being equipped with the same DC barrel connector as the M2 but by reading through the forums and http://linux-sunxi.org/Banana_Pi_M3#Sudden_shut_offs_.2F_maximum_consumption_.2F_cooling_vs._consumption it’s obvious that the DC barrel has been replaced by micro USB causing all sorts of problems. Lucky customers since they don’t have to discuss and can return their boards with full refund if they didn’t start to try to fix this on their own.


(Joe C. Hecht) #36

Thanks for the links.

Yes, I got the version with the silly micro USB power input. I’m thinking about replacing it. I am supplying “good power” (4 amps with a very high quality “known to be excellent” short wire - I actually ordered bunches of cables and cut them up to do a compare of the “better” cables sold and what’s really inside).

I can’t see how they would sell a board like the M3 without a good heatsink (and fan). Every other board anywhere close does. I did try heatsinking everything, and to be really fair, I even “chambered” the unit, and fed it super cool nitrogen with no result - it still bootlooped and crashed, so while there may be heat issues, there are still other problems (power) and distro (it does not like a lot of our displays).

I would return the M2 and M3, but after giving so much promotion for Banana (I actually bought and give away boards to other Podcasters to encourage the project), I smell quite a story going on here, and am planning quite a write up about it. This story is a story that will get told (and it should).

If anyone is interested in talking about it, please let me know. I’m all ears.


#37

I will drive tomorrow to the shop and return the M2. No problems since advertised using wrong specifications :smile:

In the meantime I got in touch with a computer enthusiast who founded a ‘Banana club’ through email. He wrote me just a few minutes ago that here in Germany many enthusiasts love the original Banana Pi for its features and level of mature software and support. The M2 without SATA wasn’t a big deal for most of them but now they started ordering the M3 (octa-core, SATA) just to discover that there’s no SATA (according to linux-sunxi they chose the slowest USB-to-SATA bridge available. WTF?!) and that nearly everyone experiences the problems you ran into: Reboots/power-off and no way to use the full power since the CPU clocks down when overheating.

It seems experiences made with the ‘original’ Banana Pi have no relevance for M2/M3? I also read that someone here calls them wholly incompatible and I tend to agree in the meantime. It’s good to spread the word since the vendor doesn’t seem to change anything (it was a bit painful to read through comments here where two guys constantly tried to persuade the vendor to improve his software but they ignored it… and the two disappeared since then)


(Joe C. Hecht) #38

Yes, it is a sad state with the M2 and M3.

I assume much of the work is volunteer (and of so, I’m sorry), but it’s so hard to tell.

It sure appears like it’s someones job to post promotional stuff for the project, and I can’t imagine someone manufacturing boards without investing into folks to do both promotion and development. If that’s not the case, it should be.

And if we are gunning at some volunteers, and all manufacture has is volunteers, the volunteers neeed to walk, and find a better project, or the manufacture needs to “Man up” and fund the thing.

I also see a lot of fragmentation for the name and product “Banana”.

Are we dealing with “Banana”, “Leemaker”, “sinovoip”?

An “org”, a “com”, or what?

I don’t get it (and I don’t want to “get it” either). Somewhere, one of these pages starts out trying to explain some sort of lawsuit. That’s just bad news.

In fact, that all I see is “bad news”. Boards that don’t work, huge numbers of posts indicating vast support that does not exist, and customers left holding the bag.

Sorry, but either Banana (who ever that is), is going to “say sorry”, and buckle down and produce one good distro, or the whole thing needs to be shut down.

I’m holding paperweights. I’m very sure what I write gets read. Has anyone contacted me to make things right? No.

I am reminded of Nvidia contacting me, telling me I might have a board with slight defect, and how they want to express me a new board in advance. It came overnight.

Here, the best contact I can hope for is to see yet another post: “Banana Pi M3 does fantastic new feature”, and just cry when I waist my time to go look or try it.

I would much rather read “Banana Pi Facks Up - Says Sorry - No More Posts Till We Make It Right”. I could deal with that!

Joe


(noralee) #39

Dear Mentos,

I updated ubuntu 14.04.3 right version to do correction about I listed wrong version ubuntu v15.10 on youtube. As I don’t want to fool people!

Nora


(noralee) #40

Dear Rab,

BPI M3 GPU is improved.